Moderator: Modulators
Obviously you never played Industrial or have any actual clue of that scene beyond generic obligatory wikipedea reference back for TG whilst saying it is not "Noise"... Industrial is exponentially more fractured/compartmentalized that Moise in some ways... Having grown up in literally personally immersed in Chicago Waxtrax "Industrial" scene it was fucking extremely odd for most people in the "Scene" that eye even had clue who TG was... much less them ever having heard of Throbbing Gristle... and tried explaining for them that was "Industrial". Now it is commonplace knowledge... yet it sure the fuck wasn't then for most Waxtrax era "Industrial" people. You can google things yet if weren't there that doesn't make what you find from searches comfortable from your home to actually be true or at all actually applicable. Don't worry about it because regardless of what eye say you won't ever actually get any off it. No offense intended. As stated before in comparison to having to put up with "Industrial" drugged out rock star attitudes/mindset/egos Noise is slumming it in the furthest outer reaches of fucking nowheresville obscurity. Thus everything is rather fucking moot in the big picture. BTW to hell with that fag ass Lord Byron. Occultism is far more complex a topic than Industrial or Noise. Ironically "Crisis" was the original leftist band DouglasP of DIJ played in during the early 80s and now antifa threaten to protest his shows or they will cry until they blow themselves up at the venue.JLIAT wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:35 am Industrial is fairly easy to categorize, from which, under the influence of Whitehouse, was pushed into Power Electronics.
I don't worry about this, i'm very familiar with the development of late modernity and the subsequent collapse of the art object, and post modernity.
That some may want to deny this or be ignorant of it is an obvious way of dealing with what is a crisis. There is of course a certain irony, which the Chapman's play with, that the very extremes that Whitehouse employed had, were and still are practised by the very establishment they thought they confronted. This goes back to at least Lord Byron, maybe before, but certainly is a legacy of Romanticism's interest in violence, the occult and transgression.
Argument from xe2x80x9cobviouslyxe2x80x9d Which is simply not true. I use wiki as shorthand, and have shown how its wrong in some cases, PE is not a sub genre of Noise. But as a background to the ICA and the promotion of TG its reliable. I became involved in the xe2x80x9cmusic scenexe2x80x9d from the early 70s. And with what could be considered a proto 'industrial' band. I was around the ICA at the time. Admittedly I wasn't into TG, I thought their so called extremism and adoption of nutsy / Porn too 'obvious'. Get famous by shocking people, not my scene. Also this wasn't 'new', this sort of thing typified by the destruction in art movement, the likes of Hermann Nitsch... etc. And Dada before that.WhiteWarlock wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:15 amObviously you never played Industrial or have any actual clue of that scene beyond generic obligatory wikipedea reference back for TG whilst saying it is not "Noise"...JLIAT wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:35 am Industrial is fairly easy to categorize, from which, under the influence of Whitehouse, was pushed into Power Electronics.
I don't worry about this, i'm very familiar with the development of late modernity and the subsequent collapse of the art object, and post modernity.
That some may want to deny this or be ignorant of it is an obvious way of dealing with what is a crisis. There is of course a certain irony, which the Chapman's play with, that the very extremes that Whitehouse employed had, were and still are practised by the very establishment they thought they confronted. This goes back to at least Lord Byron, maybe before, but certainly is a legacy of Romanticism's interest in violence, the occult and transgression.
And as I said it was TG who it seems first adopted the 'industrial' label and the nutsy / Porn xe2x80x93 poor Xeroxing that's still thought cool by some 44 years later! And was promoted by the iCA xe2x80x9ca centre for multi-disciplinary debate, combined with avant-garde art exhibition and performances,xe2x80x9d So your point is what?WhiteWarlock wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:15 am Industrial is exponentially more fractured/compartmentalized that Moise in some ways... Having grown up in literally personally immersed in Chicago Waxtrax "Industrial" scene it was fucking extremely odd for most people in the "Scene" that eye even had clue who TG was... much less them ever having heard of Throbbing Gristle... and tried explaining for them that was "Industrial".
But I was there, @ the ICA frequently through the 70s! And if you were in UK couldn't avoid the press coverage of xe2x80x9cProstitutionxe2x80x9d. (where were you in 1976?)WhiteWarlock wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:15 am Now it is commonplace knowledge... yet it sure the fuck wasn't then for most Waxtrax era "Industrial" people. You can google things yet if weren't there that doesn't make what you find from searches comfortable from your home to actually be true or at all actually applicable.
None taken. As I said I regarded the whole TG / Prostitution / Whitehouse nutsy thing as just attention seeking and of little artistic significance. Admittedly its influence in the pop avant garde is great and still remains. But like all movements which rely on shock, its never new, and only shocking for those wanting to be offended. Anyway by 1975 I had my own studio based around a Synthi AKS... and was experimenting with electronic music. Something i'd been involved with from 1970 at college... so really the likes of TG had no interest for me. (But through the 70s and 80s I was aware of Industrial / PE.)WhiteWarlock wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:15 am Don't worry about it because regardless of what eye say you won't ever actually get any off it. No offense intended.
Actually i'd disagree, whilst the Industrial PE lot was nothing much more than mere sensationalism, it might be social critique, but that's a thin argument... ( drugged out rock star attitudes/mindset/egos ) noise around the millennium regained some intellectual credibility. Though this is still around, it is waning. IMO. But that sparked my interest in noise. Its seeming denial of 'everything'.WhiteWarlock wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:15 am
As stated before in comparison to having to put up with "Industrial" drugged out rock star attitudes/mindset/egos Noise is slumming it in the furthest outer reaches of fucking nowheresville obscurity.
Have it your way, but as I said, if you want to get to some place its good to know where you are and why. A person these days getting into PE using Xeroxed images of torture etc., is using methods from over 40 years ago. Not pathetic, but maybe a bit sad?WhiteWarlock wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 8:15 am
Thus everything is rather fucking moot in the big picture. BTW to hell with that fag ass Lord Byron. Occultism is far more complex a topic than Industrial or Noise. Ironically "Crisis" was the original leftist band DouglasP of DIJ played in during the early 80s and now antifa threaten to protest his shows or they will cry until they blow themselves up at the venue.
As in major arson... pubs being closed and demolished by the police... seriously
Ah! Dr Who..... Blakes 7 ??WhiteWarlock wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 10:01 am Eye didn't grow up in UK yet watched BBC on PBS whenever possible.... unlike most americans
77 most american kids had no fucking clue about any of that...JLIAT wrote: ↑Tue Feb 18, 2020 9:55 am TG made the headlines in all the main papers and questions asked in Parliament.
https://archive.ica.art/bulletin/prostitution-revisited
